Comments on: Anonymity, community and identity http://davepress.net/2010/09/07/anonymity-community-and-identity/ Open government and everything else Tue, 14 Sep 2010 10:27:08 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.1 By: catherine howe http://davepress.net/2010/09/07/anonymity-community-and-identity/comment-page-1/#comment-7868 catherine howe Fri, 10 Sep 2010 12:48:19 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=16819#comment-7868 Lovely post Dave - thank you And also agree with Steph and Michelle in that anonymity can strengthen group bonds - but also push them to more polarised views. The main thing for me is that though anonymity clearly lowers the barrier to entry - and may mean that more stuff gets posted - I am not sure if I want the barrier to entry that low when it comes to reasoned debate. I don't think that means you have to make identity transparent - ie you should use screenames if people prefer - but there should be the knowledge that someone can work out who is posting. I think this is even more important if you look at creating relationships between citizen/government - is it really reasonable to expect the state to have a dialogue about important issues without having any certainty as to how many individuals they are dealing with - let alone if they are citizens with rights within the decision making process. I am also increasingly uncomfortable with the engagement / democracy divide - but am in the process of getting my head together on this and will post when I have! C. Lovely post Dave – thank you

And also agree with Steph and Michelle in that anonymity can strengthen group bonds – but also push them to more polarised views.

The main thing for me is that though anonymity clearly lowers the barrier to entry – and may mean that more stuff gets posted – I am not sure if I want the barrier to entry that low when it comes to reasoned debate. I don’t think that means you have to make identity transparent – ie you should use screenames if people prefer – but there should be the knowledge that someone can work out who is posting.

I think this is even more important if you look at creating relationships between citizen/government – is it really reasonable to expect the state to have a dialogue about important issues without having any certainty as to how many individuals they are dealing with – let alone if they are citizens with rights within the decision making process.

I am also increasingly uncomfortable with the engagement / democracy divide – but am in the process of getting my head together on this and will post when I have!

C.

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By: Michele Ide-Smith http://davepress.net/2010/09/07/anonymity-community-and-identity/comment-page-1/#comment-7859 Michele Ide-Smith Wed, 08 Sep 2010 22:57:20 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=16819#comment-7859 Enjoyed this post Dave. I have read *lots* about anonymity and online communities recently. Some research studies I came across have shown that anonymity can increase participants' association with 'group norms' in online communities. Thereby strengthening online communities, as per Steph's comment. My own research in a deprived area found that anonymity was preferred when discussing local issues, because participants feared 'come back', or retaliatory attacks. E.g. when discussing anti-social behaviour. I totally agree that from a government/Council perspective accountability and identity are very important. I know that @cusiousc is exploring all of this in greater levels of detail than most of us ever will! Enjoyed this post Dave. I have read *lots* about anonymity and online communities recently. Some research studies I came across have shown that anonymity can increase participants’ association with ‘group norms’ in online communities. Thereby strengthening online communities, as per Steph’s comment. My own research in a deprived area found that anonymity was preferred when discussing local issues, because participants feared ‘come back’, or retaliatory attacks. E.g. when discussing anti-social behaviour.

I totally agree that from a government/Council perspective accountability and identity are very important. I know that @cusiousc is exploring all of this in greater levels of detail than most of us ever will!

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By: IngridK http://davepress.net/2010/09/07/anonymity-community-and-identity/comment-page-1/#comment-7858 IngridK Wed, 08 Sep 2010 08:02:35 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=16819#comment-7858 Entirely related to context. People have a need to keep some networks separate. i.e. when I was a new mom - anonymous networks were really important. I didn't want to be held accountable in my personal, credited networks for the stuff I said about my husband (not as supportive as I expected), my mom (why did she <i>say</i> that??), my mother-in-law (least said the better), my doctor (quack), how I was feeling about my new role (would my son find it later?) - and so on. So I needed the support of an anonymous network. Couldn't exactly share that kind of stuff on Facebook without major fallout. Probably shouldn't have shared it here. I think there are forums where people turn into dickwads - e.g. online comments on newspapers. And support forums where anonymity is vital. Councils need to think about these different needs when engaging with people online, too. Don't expect people to share with their Facebook friends how they've used parenting support services or accessed benefits (some might, I sure wouldn't). But they might share that kind of info in an anonymous forum without turning into dickwads. Entirely related to context. People have a need to keep some networks separate. i.e. when I was a new mom – anonymous networks were really important. I didn’t want to be held accountable in my personal, credited networks for the stuff I said about my husband (not as supportive as I expected), my mom (why did she say that??), my mother-in-law (least said the better), my doctor (quack), how I was feeling about my new role (would my son find it later?) – and so on. So I needed the support of an anonymous network. Couldn’t exactly share that kind of stuff on Facebook without major fallout. Probably shouldn’t have shared it here.

I think there are forums where people turn into dickwads – e.g. online comments on newspapers. And support forums where anonymity is vital.

Councils need to think about these different needs when engaging with people online, too. Don’t expect people to share with their Facebook friends how they’ve used parenting support services or accessed benefits (some might, I sure wouldn’t). But they might share that kind of info in an anonymous forum without turning into dickwads.

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By: Tom Phillips http://davepress.net/2010/09/07/anonymity-community-and-identity/comment-page-1/#comment-7857 Tom Phillips Tue, 07 Sep 2010 13:14:43 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=16819#comment-7857 And my apologies for the typos in my previous piece. It was types with a sandwich in one hand. And my apologies for the typos in my previous piece. It was types with a sandwich in one hand.

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By: Tom Phillips http://davepress.net/2010/09/07/anonymity-community-and-identity/comment-page-1/#comment-7856 Tom Phillips Tue, 07 Sep 2010 13:13:18 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=16819#comment-7856 Dave, useful and timely. I think there are issues here which are really down to "horses for courses", and for which general rules are hard to define. as the previous comments suggest (and I very much agree), there will be social media interactions where a degree of real or perceived anonymity is going to help people "open up", or deal with issues in a very clearly non-judgemental way. However, in terms of, say, local authorities using similar media as a community engagement tool, there are usually going to be different standards. People rightly expect a degree of accountability behind what they get from services paid by tax/Council Tax etc, and there fore need to have access to some sort of identity for things like detailed follow up, complaint, redress etc (not a compleet or very good list, but hope you get my drift). If all they are dealing with is a faceless, nameless avatar in the form of a corporate logo, we could be setting back the cause and course of open communication. There's also big issues for local authorities themselves within all of this, around reputation management. It is something that some are more sensitive about than others, but most will expect some form of assurance that when their staff are blogging/tweeting/posting etc on issues related to their daily work, they are on-message, saying things they are authorised to say etc. Plus, of course, there is a need for people to be assured that they are dealing with an authoritative, informed voice behind the logo, and not someone who is pretending, or making it up as they go along. I know that a few commentators feel that social media only really works well in a viral and slightly anarchic way, but when I look, for example, at many of the things on, say, Twitter, that get people excited enough to retweet etc, they have at their root very accountable, far from anonymous, and directly attributable sources, such as pages from press web sites, or the like. Social media as an information tool probably has a lower set of necessary standards than its use as a community engagement tool, where the focus is going to be on multi-way conversations, rather than generally one-way information broadcasting. The difference probably isn't stark, though. And of course, local authorities probably won't be able to insist on a quid pro quo. They are bound to be dealing with public who prefer to remain at least superficially anonymous on some issues. But that's cool, IMO, if it is helping an enquirer, commentator or customer iin the community to use their anonymity to help them open up about an issue in a way that using their own name might inhibit. Dave, useful and timely. I think there are issues here which are really down to “horses for courses”, and for which general rules are hard to define. as the previous comments suggest (and I very much agree), there will be social media interactions where a degree of real or perceived anonymity is going to help people “open up”, or deal with issues in a very clearly non-judgemental way. However, in terms of, say, local authorities using similar media as a community engagement tool, there are usually going to be different standards.

People rightly expect a degree of accountability behind what they get from services paid by tax/Council Tax etc, and there fore need to have access to some sort of identity for things like detailed follow up, complaint, redress etc (not a compleet or very good list, but hope you get my drift). If all they are dealing with is a faceless, nameless avatar in the form of a corporate logo, we could be setting back the cause and course of open communication. There’s also big issues for local authorities themselves within all of this, around reputation management. It is something that some are more sensitive about than others, but most will expect some form of assurance that when their staff are blogging/tweeting/posting etc on issues related to their daily work, they are on-message, saying things they are authorised to say etc. Plus, of course, there is a need for people to be assured that they are dealing with an authoritative, informed voice behind the logo, and not someone who is pretending, or making it up as they go along.

I know that a few commentators feel that social media only really works well in a viral and slightly anarchic way, but when I look, for example, at many of the things on, say, Twitter, that get people excited enough to retweet etc, they have at their root very accountable, far from anonymous, and directly attributable sources, such as pages from press web sites, or the like.

Social media as an information tool probably has a lower set of necessary standards than its use as a community engagement tool, where the focus is going to be on multi-way conversations, rather than generally one-way information broadcasting. The difference probably isn’t stark, though.

And of course, local authorities probably won’t be able to insist on a quid pro quo. They are bound to be dealing with public who prefer to remain at least superficially anonymous on some issues. But that’s cool, IMO, if it is helping an enquirer, commentator or customer iin the community to use their anonymity to help them open up about an issue in a way that using their own name might inhibit.

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By: kazwccsocialnet (Karen Ramsay-Smith) http://davepress.net/2010/09/07/anonymity-community-and-identity/comment-page-1/#comment-7855 kazwccsocialnet (Karen Ramsay-Smith) Tue, 07 Sep 2010 11:04:38 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=16819#comment-7855 <strong>Twitter Comment</strong> <a href="http://twitter.com/kazwccsocialnet" title="Twitter Comment" rel="nofollow"> <div class="ccimg1" title="kazwccsocialnet (Karen Ramsay-Smith)" style="float:left;margin-right:10px;padding:0;width:60px;height:60px;"> <img name="cc_image" title="kazwccsocialnet (Karen Ramsay-Smith)" style="float:left;margin-right:10px;padding:0;width:50px;height:50px;" src="http://purl.org/net/spiurl/kazwccsocialnet"> </div> </a> RT @davebriggs Anonymity, community and identity [link to post]<br /><br /> - <a href="http://chatcatcher.com" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Posted using Chat Catcher</a> Twitter Comment


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By: nickmhalliday (Nick Halliday) http://davepress.net/2010/09/07/anonymity-community-and-identity/comment-page-1/#comment-7852 nickmhalliday (Nick Halliday) Tue, 07 Sep 2010 09:00:31 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=16819#comment-7852 <strong>Twitter Comment</strong> <a href="http://twitter.com/nickmhalliday" title="Twitter Comment" rel="nofollow"> <div class="ccimg1" title="nickmhalliday (Nick Halliday)" style="float:left;margin-right:10px;padding:0;width:60px;height:60px;"> <img name="cc_image" title="nickmhalliday (Nick Halliday)" style="float:left;margin-right:10px;padding:0;width:50px;height:50px;" src="http://purl.org/net/spiurl/nickmhalliday"> </div> </a> RT @davebriggs Bloggy bloggy blog blog: Anonymity, community and identity [link to post] > to be or not to be transparent?<br /><br /> - <a href="http://chatcatcher.com" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Posted using Chat Catcher</a> Twitter Comment


RT @davebriggs Bloggy bloggy blog blog: Anonymity, community and identity [link to post] > to be or not to be transparent?

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By: emewalton (Elaine Walton) http://davepress.net/2010/09/07/anonymity-community-and-identity/comment-page-1/#comment-7851 emewalton (Elaine Walton) Tue, 07 Sep 2010 08:35:31 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=16819#comment-7851 <strong>Twitter Comment</strong> <a href="http://twitter.com/emewalton" title="Twitter Comment" rel="nofollow"> <div class="ccimg1" title="emewalton (Elaine Walton)" style="float:left;margin-right:10px;padding:0;width:60px;height:60px;"> <img name="cc_image" title="emewalton (Elaine Walton)" style="float:left;margin-right:10px;padding:0;width:50px;height:50px;" src="http://purl.org/net/spiurl/emewalton"> </div> </a> RT @davebriggs: Bloggy bloggy blog blog: Anonymity, community and identity [link to post] <<Greater Internet Dickwad Theory explained<br /><br /> - <a href="http://chatcatcher.com" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Posted using Chat Catcher</a> Twitter Comment


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By: Steph Gray http://davepress.net/2010/09/07/anonymity-community-and-identity/comment-page-1/#comment-7850 Steph Gray Tue, 07 Sep 2010 08:28:07 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=16819#comment-7850 Good stuff, Dave. I always wondered if the virtually total rubbish you get on YouTube comment threads was driven by the anonymity, compared to the virtually entirely sensible comments you tend to get on blog posts, especially when you host them on a corporate platform. When <a href='http://blog.helpfultechnology.com/2010/07/how-to-work-with-online-communities/' rel="nofollow">I went to see the The Student Room</a> recently, Jamie there was telling me how anonymity seems to make the community more supportive and constructive, oddly. Certainly, compared to the other network its members use - Facebook - where everything you do is attached for eternity to your real identity. Good stuff, Dave. I always wondered if the virtually total rubbish you get on YouTube comment threads was driven by the anonymity, compared to the virtually entirely sensible comments you tend to get on blog posts, especially when you host them on a corporate platform.

When I went to see the The Student Room recently, Jamie there was telling me how anonymity seems to make the community more supportive and constructive, oddly. Certainly, compared to the other network its members use – Facebook – where everything you do is attached for eternity to your real identity.

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By: lesteph (Steph Gray) http://davepress.net/2010/09/07/anonymity-community-and-identity/comment-page-1/#comment-7849 lesteph (Steph Gray) Tue, 07 Sep 2010 08:27:38 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=16819#comment-7849 <strong>Twitter Comment</strong> <a href="http://twitter.com/lesteph" title="Twitter Comment" rel="nofollow"> <div class="ccimg1" title="lesteph (Steph Gray)" style="float:left;margin-right:10px;padding:0;width:60px;height:60px;"> <img name="cc_image" title="lesteph (Steph Gray)" style="float:left;margin-right:10px;padding:0;width:50px;height:50px;" src="http://purl.org/net/spiurl/lesteph"> </div> </a> RT @davebriggs: Bloggy bloggy blog blog: Anonymity, community and identity [link to post]<br /><br /> - <a href="http://chatcatcher.com" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Posted using Chat Catcher</a> Twitter Comment


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