Comments on: Ideas, conversations and artists http://davepress.net/2010/01/30/ideas-conversations-and-artists/ Using the internet to make government more interesting Fri, 11 Jun 2010 13:45:35 +0100 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: BredaDoherty (Breda Doherty) http://davepress.net/2010/01/30/ideas-conversations-and-artists/comment-page-1/#comment-6259 BredaDoherty (Breda Doherty) Mon, 01 Feb 2010 00:19:47 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=3112#comment-6259 <strong>Twitter Comment</strong> <a href="http://twitter.com/BredaDoherty" title="Twitter Comment" rel="nofollow"> <div class="ccimg1" title="BredaDoherty (Breda Doherty)" style="float:left;margin-right:10px;padding:0;width:60px;height:60px;"> <img name="cc_image" title="BredaDoherty (Breda Doherty)" style="float:left;margin-right:10px;padding:0;width:50px;height:50px;" src="http://purl.org/net/spiurl/BredaDoherty"> </div> </a> RT @davebriggs Ideas, conversations and artists [link to post]<br /><br /> - <a href="http://chatcatcher.com" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Posted using Chat Catcher</a> Twitter Comment


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By: Neil Williams http://davepress.net/2010/01/30/ideas-conversations-and-artists/comment-page-1/#comment-6258 Neil Williams Sun, 31 Jan 2010 22:43:50 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=3112#comment-6258 @Steph - Centralised? God, no. I just mean that getting lots of civil servants to generate lots of content in lots of places (regardless of what you can do with RSS) wouldn't be the most effective way of having them collaborate. It would be one way, but that's only a small part of what blogging's about. It was a flippant comment, but if I have a point I guess it's that I get a bit annoyed by the lazy criticism that it's in some way missing the point to talk about platforms; or to get like minded people together to do so. Sounds a bit po-faced and worthy to me. Contributing to an ecosystem of ideas isn't what motivates me to give up time in the evening or weekends. @Steph – Centralised? God, no. I just mean that getting lots of civil servants to
generate lots of content in lots of places (regardless of what you can do with RSS) wouldn’t be the most effective way of having them collaborate. It would be one way, but that’s only a small part of what blogging’s about. It was a flippant comment, but if I have a point I guess it’s that I get a bit annoyed by the lazy criticism that it’s in some way missing the point to talk about platforms; or to get like minded people together to do so. Sounds a bit po-faced and worthy to me. Contributing to an ecosystem of ideas isn’t what motivates me to give up time in the evening or weekends.

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By: Steph Gray http://davepress.net/2010/01/30/ideas-conversations-and-artists/comment-page-1/#comment-6257 Steph Gray Sun, 31 Jan 2010 21:15:47 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=3112#comment-6257 Dave: yes, it was a wise move to avoid a platform conversation. I think Public Strategist asked after the event whose careers had been enhanced by blogging, and I think that's true for the three of us commenting here at least. I suppose I'm interested because I reckon there's something particular in the format and culture of regular, interactive blogging which you don't get when digitally engaging in other ways. Quite often, it's all rather lumped together with Twitter and other social media and has a bad name as a rather self-indulgent, slightly naive pasttime. There's more to it than that, clearly, and we need to explain that to people in govt I think. @Neil: 'what could be worse...' etc - how so? You want a big centralised platform? Dave: yes, it was a wise move to avoid a platform conversation.

I think Public Strategist asked after the event whose careers had been enhanced by blogging, and I think that’s true for the three of us commenting here at least. I suppose I’m interested because I reckon there’s something particular in the format and culture of regular, interactive blogging which you don’t get when digitally engaging in other ways. Quite often, it’s all rather lumped together with Twitter and other social media and has a bad name as a rather self-indulgent, slightly naive pasttime. There’s more to it than that, clearly, and we need to explain that to people in govt I think.

@Neil: ‘what could be worse…’ etc – how so? You want a big centralised platform?

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By: Neil Williams http://davepress.net/2010/01/30/ideas-conversations-and-artists/comment-page-1/#comment-6256 Neil Williams Sun, 31 Jan 2010 19:33:19 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=3112#comment-6256 I'd have thought lots of people blogging on their own little blogs is the *worst* way to create an ecosystem of ideas. A big part of what's appealing about blogging is personal publishing, and is there actually anything wrong in that? I’d have thought lots of people blogging on their own little blogs is the *worst* way to create an ecosystem of ideas.

A big part of what’s appealing about blogging is personal publishing, and is there actually anything wrong in that?

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By: Dave http://davepress.net/2010/01/30/ideas-conversations-and-artists/comment-page-1/#comment-6254 Dave Sun, 31 Jan 2010 09:45:17 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=3112#comment-6254 Hi Steph! I don't mean to denigrate blogs or blogging at all. Personally, I think it is a superb medium, perfect for debating and refining ideas, easy to do yet also remarkably powerful and sophisticated, technology-wise. I owe my livelihood to blogging - nobody would have ever heard of me if I hadn't started blogging, and I would still be stuck behind a desk at a local authority somewhere - and I would encourage everyone and anyone to give it a go. Further, on the blogging front, one of the people I was thinking about when I wrote the original post was <a href="http://blogs.gartner.com/andrea_dimaio/" rel="nofollow">Andrea DiMaio</a>, whose blogging perfectly hits the mark when it comes to analysis and comment on government techy stuff. Do we have an Andrea in the UK? I'm not aware we do...and I think we need one. But my purpose in saying that focusing on blogging was wrong was because I did not want to put people off joining in because of the 'b' word. Also, a lot of the discussion of the original post was centered on blogging about blogging, or blogging about social media. What I was getting at was a wider discussion about how we talk about government and ideas, without getting bogged down in specific social media issues or holy wars about whether Blogger is better than Tumblr (or whatever). Hi Steph! I don’t mean to denigrate blogs or blogging at all. Personally, I think it is a superb medium, perfect for debating and refining ideas, easy to do yet also remarkably powerful and sophisticated, technology-wise. I owe my livelihood to blogging – nobody would have ever heard of me if I hadn’t started blogging, and I would still be stuck behind a desk at a local authority somewhere – and I would encourage everyone and anyone to give it a go.

Further, on the blogging front, one of the people I was thinking about when I wrote the original post was Andrea DiMaio, whose blogging perfectly hits the mark when it comes to analysis and comment on government techy stuff. Do we have an Andrea in the UK? I’m not aware we do…and I think we need one.

But my purpose in saying that focusing on blogging was wrong was because I did not want to put people off joining in because of the ‘b’ word. Also, a lot of the discussion of the original post was centered on blogging about blogging, or blogging about social media. What I was getting at was a wider discussion about how we talk about government and ideas, without getting bogged down in specific social media issues or holy wars about whether Blogger is better than Tumblr (or whatever).

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By: lesteph (Steph Gray) http://davepress.net/2010/01/30/ideas-conversations-and-artists/comment-page-1/#comment-6249 lesteph (Steph Gray) Sat, 30 Jan 2010 17:32:58 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=3112#comment-6249 <strong>Twitter Comment</strong> <a href="http://twitter.com/lesteph" title="Twitter Comment" rel="nofollow"> <div class="ccimg1" title="lesteph (Steph Gray)" style="float:left;margin-right:10px;padding:0;width:60px;height:60px;"> <img name="cc_image" title="lesteph (Steph Gray)" style="float:left;margin-right:10px;padding:0;width:50px;height:50px;" src="http://purl.org/net/spiurl/lesteph"> </div> </a> RT @davebriggs Ideas, conversations and artists [link to post] #ukgc10<br /><br /> - <a href="http://chatcatcher.com" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Posted using Chat Catcher</a> Twitter Comment


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By: davidwilcox (David Wilcox) http://davepress.net/2010/01/30/ideas-conversations-and-artists/comment-page-1/#comment-6248 davidwilcox (David Wilcox) Sat, 30 Jan 2010 16:34:42 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=3112#comment-6248 <strong>Twitter Comment</strong> <a href="http://twitter.com/davidwilcox" title="Twitter Comment" rel="nofollow"> <div class="ccimg1" title="davidwilcox (David Wilcox)" style="float:left;margin-right:10px;padding:0;width:60px;height:60px;"> <img name="cc_image" title="davidwilcox (David Wilcox)" style="float:left;margin-right:10px;padding:0;width:50px;height:50px;" src="http://purl.org/net/spiurl/davidwilcox"> </div> </a> RT @davebriggs: Ideas, conversations and artists [link to post] <- moving beyond unconferencing to learning and action<br /><br /> - <a href="http://chatcatcher.com" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Posted using Chat Catcher</a> Twitter Comment


RT @davebriggs: Ideas, conversations and artists [link to post] < - moving beyond unconferencing to learning and action

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By: Steph Gray http://davepress.net/2010/01/30/ideas-conversations-and-artists/comment-page-1/#comment-6247 Steph Gray Sat, 30 Jan 2010 16:02:29 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=3112#comment-6247 I agree there's an issue here, but I wonder if other colleagues in government would. To them, I suspect there is a fully-functioning ecosystem of ideas, but it's not an ecosystem that's particularly web 2.0-enabled. It's an ecosystem of representative groups, membership organisations, stakeholder workshops, roadshows, citizens' panels and media discussion, where the ideas are collated and the data analysed by colleagues in other departments (within the GSI, and generally by email) perhaps with the assistance of trusted think tanks. What's interesting about (official) blogging in particular - even more so than social networking or Twitter which are generally more atomised and personalised - is that it provides a publishing channel for individuals and teams to the wider world. Some find this concept terrifying and unmanageable ('how would we cope with all the feedback?' 'What about the p0rn?'), some find it professionally terrifying ('but I'd be exposed personally', 'my press office/manager would hang me out to dry - or more likely stop me before I start'') and a bigger chunk still can't square the time and effort required to blog with the objectives of their role. These same people would write articles and present at conferences, but struggle to see the value in putting it on a blog, to reach an unknown, international, public audience. Of course, if you put valuable stuff out there, interesting people you'd never normally meet provide you value in return. But we're a way away still from that realisation. The argument for personal blogging is a bit more straightforward: build a reputation, get connections, share your projects, socialise. Frankly, I'm still not sure whether the murkiness of the rules is a help or a hindrance to personal blogging. We muddle on. So you and Stefan and Dom and David are right to point to the bigger problem. But there's something special and powerful about blogging which deserves exploration in its own right, I think. I agree there’s an issue here, but I wonder if other colleagues in government would. To them, I suspect there is a fully-functioning ecosystem of ideas, but it’s not an ecosystem that’s particularly web 2.0-enabled. It’s an ecosystem of representative groups, membership organisations, stakeholder workshops, roadshows, citizens’ panels and media discussion, where the ideas are collated and the data analysed by colleagues in other departments (within the GSI, and generally by email) perhaps with the assistance of trusted think tanks.

What’s interesting about (official) blogging in particular – even more so than social networking or Twitter which are generally more atomised and personalised – is that it provides a publishing channel for individuals and teams to the wider world. Some find this concept terrifying and unmanageable (‘how would we cope with all the feedback?’ ‘What about the p0rn?’), some find it professionally terrifying (‘but I’d be exposed personally’, ‘my press office/manager would hang me out to dry – or more likely stop me before I start”) and a bigger chunk still can’t square the time and effort required to blog with the objectives of their role. These same people would write articles and present at conferences, but struggle to see the value in putting it on a blog, to reach an unknown, international, public audience. Of course, if you put valuable stuff out there, interesting people you’d never normally meet provide you value in return. But we’re a way away still from that realisation.

The argument for personal blogging is a bit more straightforward: build a reputation, get connections, share your projects, socialise. Frankly, I’m still not sure whether the murkiness of the rules is a help or a hindrance to personal blogging. We muddle on.

So you and Stefan and Dom and David are right to point to the bigger problem. But there’s something special and powerful about blogging which deserves exploration in its own right, I think.

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By: davebriggs (Dave Briggs) http://davepress.net/2010/01/30/ideas-conversations-and-artists/comment-page-1/#comment-6246 davebriggs (Dave Briggs) Sat, 30 Jan 2010 13:29:42 +0000 http://davepress.net/?p=3112#comment-6246 <strong>Twitter Comment</strong> <a href="http://twitter.com/davebriggs" title="Twitter Comment" rel="nofollow"> <div class="ccimg1" title="davebriggs (Dave Briggs)" style="float:left;margin-right:10px;padding:0;width:60px;height:60px;"> <img name="cc_image" title="davebriggs (Dave Briggs)" style="float:left;margin-right:10px;padding:0;width:50px;height:50px;" src="http://purl.org/net/spiurl/davebriggs"> </div> </a> Ideas, conversations and artists [link to post]<br /><br /> - <a href="http://chatcatcher.com" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Posted using Chat Catcher</a> Twitter Comment


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